1800 letter

[RJD]

well, RJD I am getting an education, thank you. But even if what you and others say is true, isn't that between 800flowers and their (presumably ) soon to be disgruntled customers? Why are retail florists getting involved?

Because we deliver the arrangements, and we're the ones who get the complaints, and we're the ones who get the bad rap about being overpriced, even though we don't tack on additional $12 order fees.

Consumers aren't going to be disgruntled until after their holiday is ruined, so we feel it's better to try and get the word out before that happens.

[racer]

Yes they whine!! The problem I see with this whole thing is why do they continue to fill the orders for the people they want out of business? This is all foolish. If you want a grass roots movement you need to start where you can make a difference. If 800flo and ftd.com and teleflora.com couldn't find a florist to same day deliver their items then you the retail florist could own that market again but as long as you want to make a sell at the expense of yourself then keep your mouth shut. As any wire service rep will tell you any time you ask. If that shop doesn't fill it some other shop will.

Stop the whine. Give up on Government fighting the fight for you and MARKET yourself and worry about your own business. You just might sell some flowers. You left the door open and they saw the light.

[RJD]

I think several of you are missing the point, here, and that's sad.  Where is the anti-florist vitriol coming from?  If you think we're whiners, let me know who you really are, and I'll be glad to be sure to never do business with you.  No sweat off my back--plenty of outstanding growers and brokers out there.

[Justaflorist]

Racer -

See what passes as 'filling orders': http://www.juggopop.com/b/59/1800flowers-bad-marketing-photos/

Is this anyway to grow the flower business?  From growers, to shippers to wholesalers to retailers - we should all be concerned with quality and with honestly portraying our products and services.

And we shouldn't have to hide behind deception, half-truths, disclaimers and the small print.

We can't stop 'florists' like that from filling orders.  It's their business model, their 'artisan member' and their problem.

But the rest of us shouldn't be drug down or forced to compete with false advertising. 

The shipping (the actual delivery of their orders by florists) isn't 'free' and they shouldn't use that promise to fool consumers... unless you think it's OK to dupe flower buyers.

[nomas]

As a consumer I would never order flowers from a wire service. As a long time flower person I see no value in ordering thru a wire service. Why do I want less flowers for more money with all their bogus charges??

I wish the retailers at flowerchat well on this project it is deceptive and it does hurt our industry from every aspect.

[racer]

I still ask the question, why do you continue to fill the orders for these crooks? You as retailers are the ones who keep them in business. The retail flower business is not unlike any other industry. Take car dealers for example. There are crooks there also. You say go look at the photos. I did and all I have to say is many of you need to go out of business to save the rest who really care about the industry. I have to say I travel a lot and when I go to other towns I go to both non traditional and traditional flower outlets. In many cases the retail florist are the worse of the bunch. Many times you will find them with little product and much of it of very low quality. As a retailer you need to walk into your front door and look around. Would you want to do business with yourself? I'm not trying to cut down the industry of retail florists but quality starts at home. Many times I can't even get someone to come out of the back room and wait on me. Florists are retail outlets not boiler room flower filling stations. Or are you?
So stop filling the orders and then you can stop whining. You hold your future in your own hands and the government isn't going to hold your hands for you.

[BOSS]

You say go look at the photos. I did and all I have to say is many of you need to go out of business to save the rest who really care about the industry.

No truer words....

Keep in mind, many of us do not fill for the likes of FTD.com, or 800Flowers and only fill for other like minded traditional florists.  This business is going away and will continue to erode.  Some of us, myself included have added links on our retail sites to send consumers directly to the delivering florist...this too may be a trend, but probably not.

Some of us are way more concerned with our local retail sales, than with the wire business...and rightfully so, as in my case, wires both in and out together total less than 6% of my total business...not a number for me to worry about.  That said tho...I still feel a moral obligation to try and right the industries wrongs....

[racer]

I understand what you're saying Boss, but you are trying to preach to the wrong group  of people. This is to the point it will be almost impossible to stop unless you unite the retail florists and shut them down. As long as you allow them to keep their hands in the pockets of the industry this will continue. This is not only bad for the retail florist but the wholesaler, importer and grower. The retail segment becomes weak and then they start using the rest of the floral chain as their bank. You see, 800flowers, ftd.com and Teleflora to name a few will always get their money no matter how low they sell your product. You can call what they do as deceptive or you can call it smart marketing with a stupid supply chain. It still goes back to the fact that if you don't fill the order another shop in your town will. This is a fact. So until those shops go broke the system will continue as it is. The government will take years to accomplish anything. This same thing is going on in many industries and you are a small speck. There are a lot larger hitters than your 100 or so retail flower shops trying to change this practice but for now it is here to stay. You can go through the web and find this on hundreds of web sites including some of the largest retailers. You  call it deceptive they call it marketing. Some of these guys are doing more business than all of your retailers put together. I remember the days when all the retail florists were begging for these orders from these guys. This was the fools gold that got this whole mess started. They were told it wasn't good for the industry but they found a way to get orders without working for them. Now today you have created a whole new segment that controls a good chunk of the orders and some very poor flower shops that make all of us look bad.

Again, if you want to stop the practice in the industry you have to shut down the source. As the old saying goes, Just Say NO.

[Bigted]

"I remember the days when all the retail florists were begging for these orders from these guys. This was the fools gold that got this whole mess started"

A lot of florists still do.  According to the field reps, the most often asked question asked by retail shops is "how can I get more orders?"  However, Boss is right.  As the internet continues to get more popular as a shopping vehicle, more people are calling their local florist.

STILL, this is not the issue.  The issue is should 1800 get to use deceptive advertising to grow their business.  I think not.

[BOSS]

you can call it smart marketing with a stupid supply chain.

Again, if you want to stop the practice in the industry you have to shut down the source. As the old saying goes, Just Say NO.

I'd say thats about the most profound statement on the issue I have heard in a long time!!

Has it struck anyone else as odd, that it's really florists (the 150 or so) that this does not really affect that are trying to fix the problem for the rest of the masses?  The "stupid supply chain" got me to thinking...WTF???  Let them go out of biz...those of us left will be stronger because of it!  But then, it's only us...that are speaking up and out...maybe we should just shut up, let the industry die, and then carry on....

[miliflwrs]

you can call it smart marketing with a stupid supply chain.

Again, if you want to stop the practice in the industry you have to shut down the source. As the old saying goes, Just Say NO.

I'd say thats about the most profound statement on the issue I have heard in a long time!!

Has it struck anyone else as odd, that it's really florists (the 150 or so) that this does not really affect that are trying to fix the problem for the rest of the masses?  The "stupid supply chain" got me to thinking...WTF???  Let them go out of biz...those of us left will be stronger because of it!  But then, it's only us...that are speaking up and out...maybe we should just shut up, let the industry die, and then carry on....

The revolution start with just a few at a tea party.

[Williee Armellini]

I am not sure what Flowerchats rules are and not sure I will try to find out. I have enough to do trying to keep this site interesting. I imagine Boss has reasons for his actions.

We like all comments from all posters (most of the time) Not sure why someone from outside the biz would want to post here but Tofu did and we are more confused for it.

[racer]

OK, I give up. But my point is your retail florists friends fill the orders that you want to stop from going through the system. As I see it there are many more shops that want the orders no matter how they get them than don't want them. I would bet you that those shops who elect to fill them could care less what they do to get the customer to purchase the flowers so they can fill them. I also will bet that there are many more shops filling the orders than are complaining about how 800flowers is going about getting the consumer to purchase the no-delivery arrangements. Don't get me wrong I agree with you but I don't think the majority of retail florists want that order stream to stop.

[BOSS]

OK, I give up.

Don't get me wrong I agree with you but I don't think the majority of retail florists want that order stream to stop.

Naw...never give up...unless she's chasing you

And you are right...the majority of florists do want those orders, but likewise that same majority has little clue what those orders do to their bottom line.  Many don't even know where to look or what to look for.

Peace out.

[Williee Armellini]

Smashing. I am not sure what the point is! Just like I can run this board as I see fit Boss can make his own rules with his. If Flowerchat starts making policies that effect the general retail business then perhpas a closer look is due but until then let them do what they think is right.

There is likely good reason that he protects which members they allow. Any good club does that and perhaps that is what is missing here. If I read you correctly Flowerchat is a club and chooses its members.

Not sure what is wrong with that? They seem to tackle problems that they perceive to be detrimental to that group.